Has this obsession with 'Tone' got much to do with music?

[johnwtuggle]

Here's Derek Trucks thoughts on tone.

http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyl...cks-Interview/

For me it's all about getting the sound that's in your head to come out. I usually don't buy tons of amps. I played a twin reverb for 15 years before getting the Vibrolux that I love now. It's the amp for me, and really I don't spend time looking for anything else.

Both amps have made me want to sit down and just play. That's what tone is about for me.

[bluesjunior]

Originally Posted by rob2001

I suppose, if you aspire to be one of these "top players"......good luck with that! Buying their EXACT rig is surely no guarantee you will sound like them.

But honestly, how many fit in that category??? 20, 30, 50, Out of MILLIONS of guitar players over 50 years of guitar based music??? Do the other 99,000 great guitar players have crappy tone to blame for not making it to that level?

And I sure don't want to open the tone is in the hands debate... but these top players are not defined by the rig they play....only here on TGP do players get put on the pedestal because of the gear they use.

I think you have misunderstood me somehow. I don't believe gear has much to do with tone. Tone for me is how a person sounds. I believe Eric Clapton, Jeff Beck, SRV, Hendrix etc, etc, ad infiniteum would sound like themselves regardless whether they were using a cheap import guitar and amp or a '59 Les Paul and a Dumble, they would just sound better on the expensive gear but nonetheless themselves. I can get a satisfying to me, tone out of my gear as I am sure you, and all the others here can on theirs. I believe every single guitar player has their tone but some godgiven few players have a unique tone. I also believe that the thing that sends some off us guitar players on an endless gear quest is the inability to accept the fact that they don't have a unique tone. That is not to say that they don't sound good in fact most of us sound perfectly ok. I think Clapton himself expressed it best when he said, "Tone is in the Trousers", Either you have it or you don't, good tone can be found by most any player with a set of ears but unique tone is something you are born with. Just my two cents worth.

[Derek Q]

For me, this:

Originally Posted by GearOnTheBrain

i agree.
i think obsessing over tone has nothing to do with composing music or being a musician.
if you have talent and are creative, there is no need to obsess over tone.
those who obsess over every minute detail of their gear in my opinion are not musicians.
they're hobbyists.
its a hobby. it an indulgence.
and it does NOT equal good music.
it has nothing to do with music.
sure, i guess by definition, if one plays guitar, than they are a "musician", but you know what i mean.
like someone mentioned, all the classic rock legends that are worshipped around here did not stress and obsess over esoteric gear or hand made this and point to point wired that.
even most pros nowadays dont use the silly over hyped boutique gear in their rigs, and if they do, its pretty minimal and alongside mass produced stuff.
"the quest for tone" is just a silly indulgence that is mostly flaunted by middle aged men chasing down tones from 40+ years ago.




...and robben ford cheerleaders.



oh, and my answer to the OP's question is...........................no.

And this:

i'd rather be chasing nuances in my playing rather than a nuance in tone - ymmv

and this:

Naw ... too many folk make simply wonderful music without such a concern ...

and this:

Creativity, talent, a good song and a solid performance will trump the tones used.

and this:

Buying their EXACT rig is surely no guarantee you will sound like them.

and especially this:

For me, it's all about music. Without music, tone can be irrelevant.

[Jahn]

hmm, thinking about it, mebbe i'm an acoustic guitarist, and an electric hobbyist then.

[AJ Love]

Yes TONE is incredibly important. What you sound like helps greatly in conveying the emotion of the music to the listener.

That said, guitar lessons from a top pro have been just as important in my development as a guitarist... just as important as the time spent in my search for the best sounding gear that I can afford.

Not more important. And they aren't mutually exclusive either...

Practice, practice, practice. But by all means, please try to sound the best you can too.

I will say that with tone, expensive doesn't always equal great sounding. And we all have our personal preferences

[rob2001]

Originally Posted by bluesjunior

I think you have misunderstood me somehow. I don't believe gear has much to do with tone. Tone for me is how a person sounds. I believe Eric Clapton, Jeff Beck, SRV, Hendrix etc, etc, ad infiniteum would sound like themselves regardless whether they were using a cheap import guitar and amp or a '59 Les Paul and a Dumble, they would just sound better on the expensive gear but nonetheless themselves. I can get a satisfying to me, tone out of my gear as I am sure you, and all the others here can on theirs. I believe every single guitar player has their tone but some godgiven few players have a unique tone. I also believe that the thing that sends some off us guitar players on an endless gear quest is the inability to accept the fact that they don't have a unique tone. That is not to say that they don't sound good in fact most of us sound perfectly ok. I think Clapton himself expressed it best when he said, "Tone is in the Trousers", Either you have it or you don't, good tone can be found by most any player with a set of ears but unique tone is something you are born with. Just my two cents worth.

OK...we agree!! Not sure how I mis-read your post. I guess when you mentioned "having their own tone" I assumed you were talking about their rigs. I totally agree with all of the above, and your previous post in the context you intended.

[Tone Disciple]

I think some of this discussion is based on differences in how we use terminology and interpret the OP's original comment.

For me, great TONE is no substitute for muscality and creativity. But - great musical melodies are nothing without great tone, feel and instrument choices.

For those who are remembering fondly the early tone of many of their idols, I think their memeory is failing them. I have many Jeff Beck, Clapton and early Stones on my iPod, and the tone on their records is horrible as is the recording quality. A listen to Truth, Wired, and so on will help you recall this. The tone is bad even though the musicianship and creativity is great.

Also remember that all gear was cheap back then. Current costs for a basic setup we all used back then is in the thousands. What would a Les Paul and a Super Reverb made in the US cost today? Thousands of dollars.

Then there are the aspects of tone such as how you use your hands to create sound. Getting a good vibrato can take a long time to master. How you fret and release notes all impacts tone and I work on this a lot.

How can you argue that this is unimportant to musicality and the quality of the music?

[DC1]

The way we sound, and the whole process that goes into it, will always be important. Further, anyone who thinks pros do not obsess over the way they sound does not know any pros.

And in the end, if you don't have compelling music to play, none of it matters at all...

dc

[mikefair]

I had my moment dabbling in the world of audiophiles and I couldn't hang. I found myself putting on recordings for their great engineering, but often times it wasn't what I wanted to listen to. It got in the way of enjoying music.

Chasing guitar tone is a whole different thing. Look, this is what we do. Playing music for me is all about the community - the on-stage conversation between you and your bandmates, your connection with the audience. It's downright mystical when it's right. Part of having great guitar tone is having it be absolutely right for the band you're playing in at any given time. If it doesn't fit, if it isn't your signature, it isn't right.

You can't separate great tone and a great performance. You owe it to your audience and your bandmates. It's an obsession I'm pretty comfortable with.

[billguitar64]

Tone is extremely overrated.

If you actually nail some of the tones from your favorite recordings you'll have a very unpleasant sound. Because having the best recorded guitar sound doesn't always work in a band format - you're competing with too many other tonal colors...

That's why some of the best tones are from songs where ONE person is really playing solo, and everyone else is just laying back. They can get a wonderful tone as long as they're the spotlight.

"Cause We've Ended As Lovers" for example.

I feel embarrased because I just bought a Pedaltrain PT-Pro for my prog band, and the thing is almost empty. A billion pedals will not replace knowing a billion songs, note-for-note.

Why do some people have 30+ guitars but can't play one entire song from beginning to end?

That's the real mystery, IMHO.

[DC1]

Originally Posted by billguitar64

Why do some people have 30+ guitars but can't play one entire song from beginning to end?

That's the real mystery, IMHO.

1 question.

Do you actually know anyone with 30+ guitars who cannot play one entire song?

I mean, besides an investor/collector type.

It's my theory that the gear hound who can't play is largely mythological.


dc

[billguitar64]

Originally Posted by DC1

1 question.

Do you actually know anyone with 30+ guitars who cannot play one entire song?

I mean, besides an investor/collector type.

It's my theory that the gear hound who can't play is largely mythological.


dc

That may very well be. But I'll bet they exist.

I most definitely have met many folks who do own a "Fendery" electric, a "Les Pauly" electric, an acoustic, a travel, and a classical, who still need chord/tab sheets or they can't play one song.

And don't even get me started on tuning. No wonder so many people are in a rut.

[DC1]

Originally Posted by billguitar64

That may very well be. But I'll bet they exist.

I most definitely have met many folks who do own a "Fendery" electric, a "Les Pauly" electric, an acoustic, a travel, and a classical, who still need chord/tab sheets or they can't play one song.

And don't even get me started on tuning. No wonder so many people are in a rut.

Yeah, but I know people who could play a simple song all the way through after playing for 2 weeks, so it seems that Mr. Gear hound could probably get through a Peter Paul and Mary song or two...

What often happens is that people think someone should not have nicer gear than they do, or nicer gear than some gigging player does unless they can play as well, and of course, it doesn't work that way.

Surely you don't think that someone should have to show their chops and get approval before buying nice gear, right?

dc

[Swain]

I do think it's funny to see people spend big dollars on "Tone Quests", only to listen to music from Mp3s and Ear Buds! LOL

But often I read people talking about the great Tones they get from inexpensive gear, like that's a revelation. Of course you can get "Great Tone" from cheap stuff! That describes the history of most of the classic tunes we've all heard.
"Great Tone" is the one that drives that particular musical moment/song/performance. The proper color, etc.

Also, when people say (like it's a badge of honor) "I get stellar Tones from (insert inexpensive gear here)", they aren't saying "I get crappy Tone, AND I LOVE IT"! LOL They're actually talking about their Tones being GOOD.

And GOOD is subjective.

Circular Logic?

[Neer]

Any "obsession" is not healthy.